Step into the world of high-stakes sports rivalries and passionate storytelling as Emmy-winner Barry Walton joins us to reveal the gritty and thrilling underbelly of documentary filmmaking. Barry captures the essence of the craft, unraveling the narrative behind his acclaimed sports documentary featuring NBA icons Kyle Singler and Kevin Love. Our discussion takes you from the electric atmosphere of the Detroit Pistons to the rich tapestry of archival footage that defines our past. As Barry dissects the roles of director versus producer, we're given an exclusive glimpse into the creativity and dedication driving his latest venture, "Artemis," supported by the artistic minds at Full Sail University.
Navigating through the cosmos of conspiracy theories, we touch down on the controversial tales of ex-NASA engineers and moon landing skeptics. Barry's keen insights challenge us to question the narratives fed to us by powerful organizations and the media. Meanwhile, setting sail on a more personal voyage, he shares the transformative impact of his island-hopping odyssey—a testament to the intertwining of passion, ambition, and relationships. We swing from the rigging of his sailing adventures to the grounded, yet no less tumultuous, experiences of pandemic lockdown life, contemplating the surreal reality of Zoom classrooms and the fragmented truths presented by the media.
Lastly, we pull back the velvet curtain to reveal Hollywood's radiant charm and hidden shadows. Barry recounts his journey through the glitz and the darker currents of the entertainment industry, sharing his encounters with celebrities and the struggles many face, including his own experiences with sexual harassment. It's not all grit, though, as we celebrate the awe of capturing daredevil feats and the brilliance of local artists making their mark. Settle in for a voyage of emotion, intrigue, and discovery as we navigate the intricate web of truth, trust, and tales that make our life stories so incredibly rich.
Follow us on Instagram @spacecoastpodcast
Sponsor this show
Want to watch our shows? https://youtube.com/@spacecoastpodcast
Step into the world of high-stakes sports rivalries and passionate storytelling as Emmy-winner Barry Walton joins us to reveal the gritty and thrilling underbelly of documentary filmmaking. Barry captures the essence of the craft, unraveling the narrative behind his acclaimed sports documentary featuring NBA icons Kyle Singler and Kevin Love. Our discussion takes you from the electric atmosphere of the Detroit Pistons to the rich tapestry of archival footage that defines our past. As Barry dissects the roles of director versus producer, we're given an exclusive glimpse into the creativity and dedication driving his latest venture, "Artemis," supported by the artistic minds at Full Sail University.
Navigating through the cosmos of conspiracy theories, we touch down on the controversial tales of ex-NASA engineers and moon landing skeptics. Barry's keen insights challenge us to question the narratives fed to us by powerful organizations and the media. Meanwhile, setting sail on a more personal voyage, he shares the transformative impact of his island-hopping odyssey—a testament to the intertwining of passion, ambition, and relationships. We swing from the rigging of his sailing adventures to the grounded, yet no less tumultuous, experiences of pandemic lockdown life, contemplating the surreal reality of Zoom classrooms and the fragmented truths presented by the media.
Lastly, we pull back the velvet curtain to reveal Hollywood's radiant charm and hidden shadows. Barry recounts his journey through the glitz and the darker currents of the entertainment industry, sharing his encounters with celebrities and the struggles many face, including his own experiences with sexual harassment. It's not all grit, though, as we celebrate the awe of capturing daredevil feats and the brilliance of local artists making their mark. Settle in for a voyage of emotion, intrigue, and discovery as we navigate the intricate web of truth, trust, and tales that make our life stories so incredibly rich.
Follow us on Instagram @spacecoastpodcast
Sponsor this show
Want to watch our shows? https://youtube.com/@spacecoastpodcast
This podcast is brought to you by Place Pros, commercial and Investment Real Estate and NikoTour Boutique, your one stop shop for everything cool. Barry Walton, welcome to the show.
Speaker 2:I'm glad to be here. This is awesome.
Speaker 1:It's so cool to have you here. I feel like we're in the same pool of things outside of this podcast. Yeah, you are a documentarian, you've won an Emmy and you brought it here today.
Speaker 2:I did.
Speaker 1:I brought some toys to look at or a toy, a toy, the toy, the toy. We would like to see that golden guy I brought it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, all right, we're going right to it. We're going right to it because it's sitting in front of me. We all want to hold it. Let's do this, let's do this, and I want.
Speaker 1:Jesse to feel how heavy it is Wait wait, this is the golden box.
Speaker 2:Now I think I ripped out the bottom of this golden box that used to all be mounted in here, but this is the golden box that came in. Oh, and this is the Emmy I know that's.
Speaker 1:Can we hold it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, please, no, take it. Take a look at it. This is her. Yeah, I'm.
Speaker 1:OK, it's the 2013 Michigan Emmy Awards for Sports, one Time Special. Tell us, how did you acquire her?
Speaker 2:So I was working with the Detroit Pistons at the time and I was creating a series that would play on Fox, and we created a series on Kyle Singler and Kevin Love. Kevin Love played with LeBron James, won a championship with the Cleveland Cavaliers.
Speaker 1:OK.
Speaker 2:Kyle went on to play with Durant, kevin Durant and OKC and they almost met back up in the NBA finals. But Kevin and Kyle had a high school rivalry for like three years in Oregon north and south and it went on for it was just an epic battle and so I had access to Kyle and kind of. We created this series and we played it on Fox and it obviously was successful. And then we ended it.
Speaker 1:It was about the rivalry.
Speaker 2:It was about the rivalry between Kevin and Kyle and the ongoing battle for basketball, and sports fans kind of ate it up.
Speaker 1:Cool.
Speaker 2:And Kyle was. Kyle played for Duke and he had won under Coach K, had won an NCAA championship. So he was just an interesting guy and then we kind of unfolded, you know, stories about him and his coach and it was just a fun piece it was kind of, but it was a one-off.
Speaker 1:It was just a one-off, yeah, one-time sports piece that sounds like a good story to follow.
Speaker 2:Well, here's where. Well, what I was saying when I said he played for with Kevin Girant was if they had gone back into the finals and it had been caught. Now Kyle didn't get as much playing time as Kevin Love. Kevin Love was a well-known commodity in the NBA. Kyle was kind of like a sixth man or seventh man. So unfortunately it wouldn't have been a matchup matchup. But I called his parents when they were going and I said because I maintained a relationship with them, because we went out and met them, and I said listen, if Kyle wins, I want to get back in touch with him. I go I mean if he gets in the finals against Kevin. But he never did, unfortunately.
Speaker 1:That would have been the series.
Speaker 2:That would have been the payoff right yeah because from high school can you imagine, from all those years in high school to having an NBA kind of rematch.
Speaker 1:Were you able to get archival photos and stuff?
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, we had all the high school footage and that's kind of my thing with documentary. I've got this weird. I don't completely understand my love for documentary film, but I've got this weird fact. I literally and I just recently watched this series called America in Color on Paramount and it's all this old 1900s, early 1900s footage that they recolored.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh, I think I've seen an ad for that. It's really impressive.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's really good.
Speaker 1:Whoa, OK, so there's a documentary about it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it's American history on Paramount and it's really just a well-told piece. But I could sit and watch old archive footage. I get this weird quirk. I don't even know what it is. No, it's fun.
Speaker 1:It's like a little peek into history, but you've produced seven and or directed produced slash directed. The first one I watched was Artemis and I got really curious because A I'm around producers a lot, but not directors so much. I want to know what the fine line is, because during the movie you said that or in one of your interviews that you had a crew out there. I was under the impression you were the one that was asking the questions to the folks that you met along the way. Who was your crew and how did that work?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I had this two awesome youngsters that came out of full sale.
Speaker 1:actually Props to that place which turns out a lot of them. Yeah, I wanted to go there, but I don't know if I ever applied or I didn't make it. I don't know.
Speaker 2:I still would like to go there. I wanted to go back and get a master's, but Tanner Roberts and Parker Davidson, two youngsters. Tanner loved these guys and they stayed up all night on the shore. I had access to the Apollo Viewing Center.
Speaker 1:OK, so you were the only one by the rocket. Yeah, ok.
Speaker 2:So a friend of mine, tim Honeycutt, who's an engineer, an operations engineer in NASA, had helped me gain that access and so I had access there, and then Tanner and Parker came to the first launch and that's where we got a lot of those, and those guys are so talented.
Speaker 1:They're so good at the OTFC.
Speaker 2:And what you're saying, I think, is a little bit like you mentioned fine line, like who gets all the credit and how does that? Is that what?
Speaker 1:you were thinking, yeah, well, I mean not so much credit. But yeah, what does a director do that a producer doesn't? I think they're more of the executive producer in the background. They're the ones being like you go out there and get those interviews and you go and do that time lapse. You have amazing time lapses on that documentary.
Speaker 2:Yeah, those were mine. It's a good question. I think the layers, I think the roles become more defined with the budget, with the budget and with our budget.
Speaker 1:it was basically like it was a three man band.
Speaker 2:Yeah it was exactly.
Speaker 1:Did you edit it?
Speaker 2:I did. I edited the piece and for me it was. I have a passion for space and I want to connect more to that industry and I just saw I was just like what better way than just to take advantage of an opportunity and go out and make something?
Speaker 1:to tell a story. Yeah, how did you get that opportunity? How did you connect with NASA?
Speaker 2:Well, this really started when I started. Ok, so, in full disclosure, I moved here three years ago, 2020. And getting settled. Obviously, everyone around here loves the launches and I'm one of those people. So I started going to all the launches and what I love, along with archive footage, is I love quirky subcultures and when I would go to these launches and I mean not have access, but just go to the lagoon, to the beach side You'd see all these guys on their ham radios and just picking up the signals and just hanging out to see the launch and this super subculture. And then I was down there and I found it fascinating. This one guy was an ex-NASA engineer. He had bought and built a missile-esque guidance system with a camera on it mind you, not a missile Laser-guided camera and he would pull it up to the sea. Space X kicked him off the base Because he had captured. Remember when that one launch blew up.
Speaker 1:What Like decades ago?
Speaker 2:Yeah, if you go on. I think his page is.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that happened when we were little. Now it's been like a decade. Oh OK, never mind.
Speaker 2:But maybe not that long. But anyways, I don't know all the details, but I know that he captured it. They didn't want him to release it. He did anyways, and they stopped giving him access, oh my god. So he was stuck shooting shore side, but he had this little camper, not even like a half camper, like you remember being John Malkovich.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I saw it once.
Speaker 2:And there's floor 13 and a half and you go inside and it's like half. Anyways, there's a scene that you kind of squeeze into a really small space that was his area Like I had to crawl into this cubby hole and he had all these monitors capturing the launch. It was just amazing. So I'm kind of deep diving here. But when I was there and I saw this subculture I was like this is an untold story.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, why the secrecy? I mean, I'm always poking at that.
Speaker 2:You mean what? What do you mean?
Speaker 1:With NASA, like why would they not want that footage to be released? It's just what it is. It happened, it's documented, you know.
Speaker 2:I think it's controlling your image at that level. I think it was more SpaceX and I think they just wanted to control their image.
Speaker 1:Sure, yeah, that makes sense.
Speaker 2:And they don't want third party. Especially they don't want to give Like if I'm going to let you in this close to the launch, you need to abide by our interests.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're right, you're right.
Speaker 2:And that's what I think. I mean I'm down with conspiracy theories. I love conspiracy theories. I mean I'd love to deep dive into that. I got buddies always sending me stuff about did we make it to the moon, or didn't we? I was just recently at Lockheed Martin and listening to them for an event and listening to them talk about going back to the moon and all this stuff and sometimes I'm like.
Speaker 2:on the same day that I was going, a friend of mine showed me this snapshot of a phone from the 1960s and a phone from today and he's like went to the moon 1960s phone Still can't go to the moon, still can't iPhone?
Speaker 1:They lost the telomeres, whatever those are. Is what? Yeah, my deep dive into that.
Speaker 2:Telomeres, what's that? I don't fucking know.
Speaker 1:Oh great, I don't know, but that's what I've read. And yeah, there's so many NASA engineers here and they're getting old and I'm thinking to myself somebody needs to get in their face before they get dementia. And nobody knows anything. I don't know.
Speaker 2:It's funny, I again I love conspiracy, and only because, in an effort to not be completely defranchised by this crazy world, we live in you can't say anything nowadays. I know, I know. So who am I? I'm nobody, but even I censor a little bit of my speech, which is stupid at some level, but I guess it's just the age we live in. But I don't know. I'm torn because I watch. If you watch in the shadow of the moon, they interview the astronauts and those guys are so authentic in their love and passion.
Speaker 2:I mean you listen. You should watch it in the shadow of the moon Great documentary. Okay, I'll do that. And those guys are so in and so passionate about their experience that I watch that and I have a hard time going. It's not real.
Speaker 1:Okay, to be fair, I've only watched clips of their interviews where they look really uncomfortable answering questions in front of the press. So yeah, I haven't seen those. You got it you should watch.
Speaker 2:I mean so if you watch that and then you measure it up against kind of what, and like yesterday I just a friend of mine just sent me a whole thing on the breakdown and the lines, and you know, stanley, Kubrick and how they shot it and I'm like I mean, I work in this industry, you work in this industry.
Speaker 1:Also like the camera. I've gone far enough to be like where's the camera? If they're both, we see both of them like who's operating.
Speaker 2:And they broadcast it live.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and like so the camera was supposedly on one of the legs of the lander, but also like what?
Speaker 2:I think for me here's the thing is, this could be easily debunked because we have powerful enough telescopes to just look at the moon and probably see the flag still there, right?
Speaker 1:Am I right or wrong? Am I right? Do we we?
Speaker 2:should. This is so much speculation but I feel like it could be easily debunked. So this is where I'm torn, because this is so holding both. So I like to look at things objectively and not state an opinion but have the viewer like ask themselves. And so what I say is like looking at the show of the moon, listening to the astronauts, their enthusiasm, their authenticity and going I'm conflicted. Those guys seem really legit. Some of them seem like they have strong ethics and seem like really good people. How have they held up this narrative for so long? And then turn that off and watch kind of the critical analysis of the moon footage and you kind of go hmm, that seems legit.
Speaker 2:Did they do it? Did they do it and then just re-film it? I mean what? I don't? So I don't have that answer, but it does seem like if NASA wanted, they could easily debunk it. And then we're talking about going back and apparently NASA has said that section where we landed is now they've protected it, as like every you're not supposed. Is this true? This?
Speaker 1:could be false. This could be complete. I mean, I don't know, like, who's going up there and putting the rope around, yeah disclaimer.
Speaker 2:This could be completely false, but somebody, I mean I shouldn't even say that.
Speaker 1:I mean, the truth must be somewhere in between, right? Yeah, yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2:I'm saying to the viewer ask yourself.
Speaker 1:Ask the questions. I just have like a mountain of questions. I'm not saying this or that. I just want to understand it better because-.
Speaker 2:That's what we do. That's what we do right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, we investigate.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think curiosity is healthy. Yeah, yeah yeah, a certain amount of curiosity.
Speaker 1:Naivete and curiosity Like, not cynical curiosity, I don't want to be a cynic, no, and I know that I know nothing, right? Yeah, exactly, I just want to ask questions and get an answer that kind of makes more sense.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, I'm with you on that. So that's my thought on the-.
Speaker 1:Artemis, all right, but we went a long ways off of a space. Yes, how?
Speaker 2:about you.
Speaker 1:It was so cool, you said, you got here in 2020.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I did.
Speaker 1:Where were you before that?
Speaker 2:Detroit.
Speaker 1:Detroit. Yeah, okay, I've moved a lot in my life so, but 2020 was pandemic and you made a documentary called Empty America, which I saw as well. Very well done, thank you. Tell me, how did you film that? Were you really going to all these so it was your footage. Yeah, this was a one-man band.
Speaker 2:Well, I gotta stop breathing it's not so close. I breathe in the mic here. Excuse me, audience. I'm trying to be a professional podcaster here.
Speaker 1:We're not professionals, no exactly.
Speaker 2:Exactly, that's what I like about-. Where do I start with this? In February, you know, february came Strange time for everyone. I was living in Michigan. I was already struggling with the cold.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:You know, I lived in California. I lived in warm weather for basically almost 18 years. Move back to Michigan. I'd been there for like seven years and I was me and my wife, my wife's from Italy, struggling with the cold, Locked in the house. February, March, shut down and just like what is going on, yeah, right, yeah. So here's the true story is, like I said to my wife, I just had this vision, so I used to do Jeep commercials and work for Jeep.
Speaker 1:Okay, new.
Speaker 2:Chrysler we used to go out to Moab, to Utah, to the desert.
Speaker 1:I always wondered where they filmed us. Yeah.
Speaker 2:We used to do these things in Moab in Utah. So I knew Utah well because I've been out there like six times in the last like two or three years and I said this is so weird, let's just get away from people, let's just go out to the desert. Like everyone's worried about contact, like how about if we just get away from people but we get some space. Mind you, no better time to take a vacation only from the perspective is I could barter at the hotels.
Speaker 1:With what?
Speaker 2:Because there's nobody there, I'd be like I'm a veteran. They'd be like it's 120 for the night. I'm like I'm a veteran, can you give me a discount? Could we get? I literally barter the hotels would let me barter. Never before in history I would get $120 hotels down to like $80 everywhere I went Because they were empty.
Speaker 1:Yeah, nobody wanted to go anywhere. Completely empty.
Speaker 2:We would be the only people I was loved in for months. Yeah, it was kind of eerie I would. I questioned if I was being irresponsible.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, Everybody you know. Yeah, there was this like blogger mom who got canceled because she decided to go on a journey much like yours and it's like I don't know. It was so confusing back then.
Speaker 2:Well, I wasn't really sharing what we were doing at the time.
Speaker 1:Just yeah.
Speaker 2:And I brought the cameras along as a caveat. I mean I have them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm like I'm going to and you're a documentarian yeah, I'm going to take beauty footage. Well, that's what I thought. It was so brilliant of you to take the cameras out. I know you got the.
Speaker 2:Believe it or not. I almost didn't. I know.
Speaker 1:Well, that kind of reminds me of your, the one I saw where you were on the boat. Remind me what reaching reality. Yeah, yeah, it's like, because I've faced that too, like the struggle of pulling the camera out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's there.
Speaker 1:You know, I don't know what there is.
Speaker 2:That's an interesting topic because you know, just kind of shifting from one to the other and shifting gears like man, that I think that is the difference in in kind of making it and not making it in this industry sometimes. Yes, I had the biggest struggle, that film that you mentioned reaching reality. So we go, Me and a me and a friend went on a sailing trip for two months from San Francisco down to the tip of of Mexico. We explored seven islands and it was the most miserable first month of my life.
Speaker 1:I know I want to dive more into that actually, because I could sense that it was like and then at one point, you know, let me see, I wrote down quotes this is an honor.
Speaker 2:I love this. I've never had anyone care about any of my work. You might be the person to ever show any interest in anything.
Speaker 1:It was really cool because it's like it's, it's very I don't know. I think it's what a lot of us want to do, right, but you could see your struggles. There was a line and I can't find it on my notes because they look like chicken. Oh, here it is. Barry's episodes like it was.
Speaker 1:It was touched on and the word explosions was used, and I'm curious like what that looked like, because obviously you or I are not going to point the camera in our own face when we are raging. Yeah, is that what happened on the?
Speaker 2:boat. Well, I was 20. I was 31 and probably a. You know, I I'm a, I'm a creative type and moody. Probably I wouldn't go as far as to say I'm bipolar. I'm clinically bipolar, but I'm moody, I'm emotional, I'm very, you know, I'm very in that regards and I say passion. Passion is a good word, and then you take that and you put it on like we were on a 23 foot.
Speaker 1:Okay, you know sailboats. Do you know, Are boats very well 23 small. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And we're on the Pacific.
Speaker 1:And why?
Speaker 2:on earth, yeah, okay.
Speaker 1:I know, and it's like, oh, we'll do anything to get on a boat, like I've been on surf trips and I don't understand them. It's rough, it's yeah, it's uncomfortable, and then, at the end of the day, rarely do you get the wave that you're going after. Why the hell did you do? This Because you had a cozy little life. You had a girlfriend, you left. Did you guys break up?
Speaker 2:Well, she broke up with me before I left before you broke my heart, the one that got away. The one that got away.
Speaker 1:No way, man. No, no, no, Because later you went to Italy. No.
Speaker 2:I've got the, I am there. He's like your tiny wife. Yeah, I'm so lucky right now. I don't want to. I don't want to mislead and create a narrative.
Speaker 1:But why leave those little snippets out of the dock? Were you just, were you just not thinking that that mattered?
Speaker 2:Well, you know, I think it does have to do something with maturity and growth.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:As you grow in your storytelling. And now I'm working on a documentary where the storytelling is so hard and you know when you're starting out you don't have the funding to hire people. Finally, I've gotten the funding to hire a writer and all of a sudden I have perspective I never would have had. And then that one that was all funded and done by me. I did the editing, I did everything from A to Z. So sometimes you don't, it's hard to see those things. I didn't know how to tell that and it also felt like I was taking the viewer on a journey of the trip on the boat primarily, and then, if I started talking about this relationship, did I show them the relationship? I guess I was in conflict with that and I didn't know how to delve into and it was hard to measure, like is this boring or is this interesting?
Speaker 1:You know, that's the hardest thing is like Well, you got to see the girlfriend a little bit and you know she did not like the idea. No, not at all, but then, yeah, it was like I think that my main question is I know the guys do this too and girls do this too like you pray, love, like sometimes you just have to get up.
Speaker 2:I love that both.
Speaker 1:In your situation and leave and find yourself, even if it's like you're masking this with finding the wave or even making the dock.
Speaker 2:Well, you know, I had set in my mind that if this trip it was a two month trip, if this was the difference between us making it and not making it, then, I'm not giving up the trip. Like you know, like there was a conflict, she didn't want me to go on the trip and I was like if, why not, though?
Speaker 1:Did she have a reason?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't think it was ever gonna work.
Speaker 1:Yes, there you go. It just wasn't gonna work. There you go. She ripped up, ripped out the band aid before.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know like she saved me in the trouble.
Speaker 1:Exactly.
Speaker 2:She saved me in the trouble. I don't know how much I wanted to share with everyone, but it was not. She was. That was just not the best relationship I'd had in my life. It wasn't a good. You know. Like that time in my life I was very alone. It's funny because, like you know, you'd have to follow the cycle and I mentioned that I'm writing a book and I'm kind of telling the story, which is a search for self-god love. You know, the known and the unknown, which is a yin and the yang and kind of like. Anyways, there's a lot to that. But at that time in my life I had kept kind of pushing into the unknown right. The unknown is kind of.
Speaker 1:It's freaky yeah it's the adventure.
Speaker 2:It's like I'm taking risks, I'm going places I haven't been in, and so I kept leaving friends and going to new places. And that trip and I was also had like a little bit of an addiction to adventure and travel and surf can be very addicting, and I had no balance in that. I had just like gone full into that. Like that dominated my life. I couldn't think of anything but that. So because of that, everything else was lacking and I was very lonely. And when you're very lonely it's almost like there's a certain amount of desperation and vulnerability.
Speaker 1:Lonely, even if you were coupled up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I was just yeah, and so because of that, I clung to someone that.
Speaker 1:I was clingy. Clingy, you know what I mean. But then how did you know to rip yourself apart or away, I don't know there must have been something.
Speaker 2:Well, I do think, if you, I do think I don't think enough credit is given to people. You know our awareness of what's right for us and what's wrong for us. You know what I mean. Like I knew that that wasn't a good relationship. You know what I mean, and so I don't think enough credit and I knew it from day one. So for me, I don't think enough credit is given to us on what we, on being aware. So I knew that, so when? But I was such a dramatic person, it was like I was just like, it was just such a different time in my life.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:I was just like so dramatic and just no, don't leave me. And I was so gosh, it's so funny You're kind of bringing up like parts of my life that I've kind of packed away a little bit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're like I don't wanna talk about that.
Speaker 2:I don't wanna think about it. I don't mind, I don't mind.
Speaker 1:Well, there's a lot of times when you look back and you kind of cringe at maybe reactions you've had. I know I do that and I beat myself up, but there's certain things and moments that you're just like I don't wanna think about that anymore, like you have to give yourself credit for being young and being able to sort of overcome whatever. Whatever it is that happened there.
Speaker 2:Well, you know, I mean it's funny because when I'm writing this book and retelling and it's kind of a story of my life, it's so cathartic and I go through these moments and it's funny. Like you say, I'll have moments when I'm writing that book, even from the trip where I had these explosions that you were mentioning earlier, and I'll call up Dan who's one of the characters.
Speaker 1:So you guys are still friends. I was curious about that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, very close With Dan and me talk once a week and Dennis once a month or so. Still very close. He lives in the Pacific North Northeast and Dennis is still in LA, but I'll call him up and wanna apologize. There were times Aw, yeah, cause I'm like Dan, I'm sorry that I was such a, especially when I was editing the documentary, cause I would see myself talking and then I'd be like I'm sorry, I was so upset.
Speaker 1:Was there more footage of you?
Speaker 2:that you didn't include. Oh my, gosh.
Speaker 1:There's so much I mean do you still have it?
Speaker 2:Well, if you okay, so I have on Amazon. So there's two places where you can see like a longer version. There's a longer version.
Speaker 1:I made a series. Yeah, I saw the series. It's like a four part series on Amazon.
Speaker 2:Well, on YouTube. Yeah, also, my distributor put on Amazon Prime. I have two on the four part series. I said no one's watching that, let's just leave the one on, and they took the videos off, but they left the anyways, whatever.
Speaker 1:But if Wait, I have a question For the young documentarians out there how the hell do you get your stuff on Amazon? You say you have a distributor. Well, it's a lot harder than it used to be. Really.
Speaker 2:Amazon has got has really buckled down post like the age of like conflict, of sharing information and getting misinformation and all this stuff. So pre COVID, my distributor, could just I have a distributor in Europe and it's crazy, it's a footnote Like this stuff has been seen in Russia. He would hit me up and be like, hey, I just got an offer for a couple thousand dollars to show this in Russia and I'm like sure, let's do it.
Speaker 1:That's so cool.
Speaker 2:No, I know, it was kind of cool. What would be funny is if I went to Russia someday and they're like you're yeah, exactly, and I'm like, wait, no one knows me in America, but I'm like David Hasselhoff in Germany. You know what I mean? Yeah, that would be so awesome. That would be my dream. At least somebody knows me, you know.
Speaker 1:I don't care if it's the Russians, okay.
Speaker 2:so we got a nasty conflict going on. Caution red light, red light. No one knows anymore, right Okay?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:In America, I don't wanna-.
Speaker 1:We'll have to come back and do like a full on conspiracy theory breakdown.
Speaker 2:I'd love to do that. Yeah, that would be fun. That would be fun.
Speaker 1:I've been waiting for the right person.
Speaker 2:I mean if I'm on it.
Speaker 1:Or like a table discussion.
Speaker 2:I think it's a great idea.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I'm like I would go into COVID cause again. We were talking about the trip across America, part of that just so, just to kind of for the audience is following along. We opened up the COVID trip and we opened up kind of the sailing trip.
Speaker 1:So if I were to jump back to that trip, yes, so the COVID trip was across America and the audio was just from like radio stations, but the visuals were like landscapes and just stops and stuff.
Speaker 2:Let me ask you a question. When you said you were locked in your house when this all went down? Okay, so none of us have had an experience like this ever, Ever yeah. What was going on with you? Like what was it.
Speaker 1:I was up in Jersey, so like right next to New York, just on the outskirts, and we locked ourselves for months, like to think about it now, to be like what do you mean? You were in your house for months. We were the type of people that would get groceries delivered and fucking scrub them before they ever went in the house. Months of that. And then I remember the first time we went outside it must have been like late spring and we were like terrified to have people walking by. And then we went back inside and like hid for another two weeks before we're like maybe we should go out on a car ride. And we went to Hoboken and there was people just like living their lives and we're like what? Like we were kind of in disbelief because we thought everybody was just staying in their house, nobody was walking or going to cafes or anything. So that was kind of eye-opening. And then, you know, even my daughter, quincy, like the first time a human like went near her. She freaked out and like came running back.
Speaker 1:So it was a mind fuck for a while I think months, months later, we decided to come down here. We grew up here and then that was even more like what in the hell have we been fed? Or like we took extra precautions. I thought we were all going to die for a while there and I didn't want to.
Speaker 2:So wait, when you say, what have we been fed? What did you start to like? Did you have a moment? Where have you come to a resolution on that and would you handle it differently? And what do you see differently? Do you any thoughts on that?
Speaker 1:No, I feel like it just had to be the way it was you know, I don't and I don't know, I don't, I don't know. There's almost too much to say.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I do remember switching between Fox and CNN and trying to sort of find some common truth or ground. It was so confusing. But I just remember being terrified for months and then dealing with like somebody that's she was like four or five Zoom schooling like it was ridiculous. Did you have your son then? Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:That was driving me nuts.
Speaker 1:Oh, my God.
Speaker 2:See, we're see, I it's funny because I think this is a great conversation, because I think, and what you said about like it's almost too much to talk about and I think there's not a lot of people that will unpack it anymore.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:It's kind of like, as a society, we've all said look, it's kind of like the relationship thing that we just were talking about with me. It was just like I've kind of put that away.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, like why even poke at it.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:There's truths to both sides, but also, like I see, I guess, in light of this new COVID variant, I guess maybe I'm hesitating to say anything because I don't, I don't want people to die, but are they still dying? And if they are dying, is it because of that or is it other issues? I don't, I don't, I don't know, I don't know.
Speaker 2:See, I don't. I See now that the humorous side of me wants to say I don't care if people die. I just and I used to say that I used to be on the phone. So I was doing a call with some friends in Europe, actually my friend Lars, who lives in London, and my friend Cody actually is in Australia. So we were on a Zoom call together and during the lockdown and they were calling me to ask me like what are you doing? You're driving around the country.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, australia was super locked down. Yeah, so Australia was crazy.
Speaker 2:And I'm like and Lars is like, I just don't want to be killing people. Barry, all pompous and I'm like I don't really care if people die, but I said that in a sense of like I drive you know, like that was the crux of COVID. It was all of our responsibility not to kill each other.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Right, and that was a hard thing to navigate, because is it really, you know? And everyone would be like, well, we're in a social contract with each other, right? Yeah, it's nice, barry, you can have this experience, but we have a social contract and a social responsibility to each other. And I was, and I always was, like, well, that's true of everything you know, but you can always take it to the extremes and like, where does that responsibility begin and end? And so, for me, all I care about is just having the conversation, in a sense that, like I took a much different approach.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I went the other way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you did.
Speaker 2:And so, for me, I want to talk to someone like you and understand you better, and I would hope that you and people like you would want to understand me better.
Speaker 1:I understand both sides, like I understand why you did what you did and I understand why I did what I did. And I wonder well, you know, I was saying we were watching the news, the two news outlets but after a while I'm like let's shut this off and never turn it on again. And that's what we did, you know.
Speaker 2:That's amazing. I love it I have. I was talking to a friend of mine recently. He's 70, one of my close friends. He was out in California and he was just recently. We got a phone and in the first two minutes of the conversation he started ranting about the Trump indictment and he was like so worked up and so angry and I'm like Pablo, like what dude? Like there's so many other things I'd rather talk about.
Speaker 1:I haven't talked to you in like four months, especially when people are like so aggravated about it. I mean as a girl who I won't go into that. But I don't understand sports, I don't like them, and it's because I think it's because it's the same thing People get so ragey, you know, like when my husband's team loses. I mean he's very, but I could tell it affects him.
Speaker 2:You know like he gets, and what I was saying in relation to you turning the TV off was I said wait, where do you get all this stuff from? And he's like, oh, I'm watching. And he's going through the networks and I'm like, pablo, I stopped watching news a long time ago.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think they showed us the true colors right.
Speaker 2:I mean, it's just, it's rage, it's. They're incentivized by rage and in fact, they're entertainment companies. Right no.
Speaker 1:It's not news per se.
Speaker 2:Okay, back to. So, back to the film, part of who we are. Yeah, and I think this is valid, and I was having this conversation and I hope I don't lose the thought because it was just there, but I was talking about this. You know, jordan Peterson talks about the sacred, the sacred let's see the sacred falling into the profane, something like that, and what that basically means is there are things in life that the human, because we're so simple and we categorize quickly things as good and bad, and we want to have clear understandings of characters. I want to know who you are. You know, I listened to you talking with Shargood. She's like she knows her brand. She's like I'm good, I'm happy.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean. I love her, by the way. I love her. Yeah, she's great.
Speaker 2:And that's easy for people to characterize. So when I saw, like Wolf Blitzer, cnn anchor on a movie, for me that was a definition of the sacred falling into the profane meaning. He went from an outstanding reporter of truth to a fictional actor in a fictional story. Right, and what I knew as a filmmaker is my mind subconsciously now. Right now I'm thinking I'm aware I'm in this industry, so I know how to critically analyze characters.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:But I'm trying to think from the layman's perspective. Their subconscious mind has suddenly begun to question truth. Why? Because how do I know when he's acting and when he's not acting? Yeah Right, so I don't ever remember Tom Brokaw being in a film. I don't ever remember. You think of the greatest character anchors in American news? They never crossed that line Right.
Speaker 2:And then these guys start crossing this line from entertainment for money and you're like what's truth? And so for me, truth is in question. And I was having this talk with Paul and I'm like he's like how can people support this side or that side? And I'm like dude, nobody trusts anybody.
Speaker 1:Is that you think that's? I mean, yeah, I guess if you're on the left you don't trust the right, and then people like I don't know me, who are on neither side. I don't trust either of them.
Speaker 2:I think most people don't. I think the truth of the matter is if we really knew. The majority of people don't trust anyone and the hard part of that is they're left to their own devices to decide. So they go. I don't trust anyone, but I'm in this group, this tribe working class group, whatever, and then I can relate with what they believe in and so I'm going in that direction.
Speaker 2:And I'm in this corporate group and I'm in this side and I can relate with cause. I know corporate culture and my dad was a working class man and he worked in the steel foundry his whole life. So I know working class culture and I did the corporate thing and then I was like screw it all, I'm going on my own. But so I sit on both sides and I go. When you have no trust, you just trust your tribe.
Speaker 1:Right, and I think maybe that's that might've been your mentality when you decided to go on the journey, like it's not that you really don't care if anybody dies. It's it's-.
Speaker 2:I was just curious. You're curious, what's going on. You're like yeah, I was like what is going on?
Speaker 1:Or also you have to do things for yourself, like if, if what you say is true, that you don't, you don't trust, then it's almost like being in an abusive relationship Like there. There has to come a point where you shake yourself and be like you have to love yourself. You know before you Well, I do, and that's where I was.
Speaker 2:I mean, look, I work in marketing, I understand messaging.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I understand and I work with. I work really hard on working on creating what they call quote unquote organic. They don't call it organic anymore. What do they call it? They call it something else. But anyways, you know what I mean by organic. It's authentic.
Speaker 1:So what are, what are some of your clients? This is through endless media.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Your, your marketing. It's a marketing company, but you're telling stories? Yeah, through the marketing.
Speaker 2:Well, one of my favorite clients and biggest clients that I've had for six years is OpenGov. They're a SaaS company out of San Francisco and and I work to tell stories of government officials and I've worked with. I've interviewed the mayor of Tampa, I've interviewed the mayor of Savannah and I've gotten to travel across the country and meet government officials and kind of tell their stories.
Speaker 1:What do you find?
Speaker 2:Just real people. That's what this next documentary is about. I'm all over the place with stories here, but I'm probably you can like jump in there. No, and it's okay. I'm probably leaving people hanging on a couple things, but I think I can answer that in a couple things. What I find is is just real people. By and large, government is full of real people that just want to do good for their community.
Speaker 1:When do you think it gets to a compromising level, like when do they leave these-?
Speaker 2:I think local governments by and large are still very pure in nature. I could say that that's why they don't have any money. I mean, really like, what we should be fighting for is that federal funding be reversed and the states stop paying so much to the federal government. One thing I'm all about is when I see states taking more power and ownership and that's a big reason I came down to Florida of their own money, because, by and large, local government is not corrupt. We still have the small time.
Speaker 1:Why else did you come to Florida? Did you have friends here?
Speaker 2:My wife's Italian. She grew up in Italy. It's warm weather and she has Italian friends down here. Really yeah there's a whole Italian community down here.
Speaker 1:Where.
Speaker 2:Well, I mean, my wife has a group of friends with like 10 and 10 friends.
Speaker 1:Are you guys? Italian American club members. We were, yeah, we've been to a couple I've been wanting to go there. I love, I love. It's a lot of fun.
Speaker 2:No it's so good for my wife. Michigan I don't wanna be down on Michigan. I love Michigan's, where I grew up, or Detroit, but this is a better city for her.
Speaker 1:That's when you went okay, can we go back? So you went on this boat. You came back. You met your wife in Costa Rica, but she was Italian.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:How long after that documentary did you meet her?
Speaker 2:The sailing documentary.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the sailing documentary.
Speaker 2:The sailing documentary. That was probably two years.
Speaker 1:Two years, so you're still traveling from were you in?
Speaker 2:Hollywood. I was doing shows for Net Geo on Animal Planet.
Speaker 1:What show did you do on Animal Planet? I did 2Q.
Speaker 2:Weird true and freaky Ooh, or are you heard of that Weird true and?
Speaker 1:freaky. No, was it good no?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was interesting. They pumped out two seasons and we ended up doing like 54 episodes and we would go and find, like Scorpion Milkers who had milk, scorpion Venom is some of the most rarest proteins on the planet.
Speaker 1:And what do you do with that?
Speaker 2:They make medicines out of it and stuff like that. They can bind it. So proteins are like, from what I understand, are like building blocks, like Lego blocks and oh, I can find this rare Lego block and that's going to make my All the pieces come together.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's going to make all. Oh, that's fascinating.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so they milk. So that was one. And we went and saw these big horned cows in the middle of America.
Speaker 1:Were you producing in the field? Field producing, yeah, so you were like right up in there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was on a plane. I could have. I should have been a pilot. I was traveling so much. I was on a plane like three or four days a week for six months straight.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:It was both the greatest and the most miserable. You know what it is. You know what it is.
Speaker 1:Like you can't enjoy the moment and again another thing from reaching reality, like you're not able to enjoy it. You wanted to be a filmmaker and here you are making your film and you are miserable. I feel like that's what it is when you're working too, like I love editing, but when I'm sitting at my desk actually doing it, like it could be really stressful and I can lose sight of it Unless. Like I'm slapping down some music, it's fun, but still you're under pressure. If you have like a really like on hands producer, you're like head off my back.
Speaker 1:Like let me just do this.
Speaker 2:It's funny because what I struggle with most in our industry is when I get on a set with a youngster who thinks it's about being cool and it's about like I'm doing you know I'm doing.
Speaker 2:And like dude, all I know is work Like this. Like all I know is like I'm not even anybody in this industry, like I may have reached a threshold in some area, but no one knows me from Adam and all I know is work. From the day I started this till now and every time I turn around it's working. If I can build up enough equity in this industry to have some time off, like I'm just like oh my gosh.
Speaker 1:It's not as glamorous as anybody thinks it is.
Speaker 2:But I couldn't do anything else. And I will have and I have moments they're like literally like that fast of a moment, like a click of a finger, where I'll be like I'm doing art and I'm making money doing it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's what I'm saying, yeah, yeah, yeah, like when I'm laying down music, that's how I feel I'm setting the mood. Yeah.
Speaker 2:This is great, yeah. And then you get a call with a client and they'll destroy everything for you.
Speaker 1:Yes, network notes are so annoying.
Speaker 2:Oh, and the client that knows how to do it. Uh-huh, I can, I know how to edit and I can. I'm like oh God, you, here we go. Thank you, oh.
Speaker 1:God, that's so funny. What other reality do you? Have you done any other shows? You haven't done reality.
Speaker 2:My favorite show. A lot of different at Geo.
Speaker 1:Not Geo okay.
Speaker 2:I'm on Defying Niagara, about the guys that go over. Niagara falls in a barrel.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, it was cool. What In a barrel? You know this.
Speaker 2:You haven't done it for years. They haven't done it since like 2000.
Speaker 1:No, I've never heard of this. 2005 was the last time. What do you mean? They get in a barrel and they throw themselves off the.
Speaker 2:They've stopped doing it for years, but like between like the 70s and 2005,. And even before, there's this long history of going over Niagara falls in a barrel. But there was an era, so we captured. It was so cool. I uncovered, I got a private investigator. We dug up like five of the top daredevils Steve Trotter, who was a Florida guy, went over twice. Dave Munday again, who was the legend and gone over twice.
Speaker 2:And then, like Peter I forget his last name, search for the B anyway, no, it wasn't Peter, it was, oh man, I'm forgetting his name he went over on acid and he came out of the barrel naked and I got him on the phone. I got him on the phone 10 years later after he'd done it. And now he's a dad with kids and I'm like, oh god, this guy was so cool. I'm like, dude, you're my hero. He's like he was so excited to hear from us. He's just one of those dads who did this wild thing and now he's on with life and he wasn't ashamed of it at all and he was telling and he dug up all his old archive. I got all his old archive of him actually coming out naked and everything.
Speaker 1:I don't understand what a barrel is. I'm picturing like a beer or like a bourbon barrel.
Speaker 2:Well, originally, I think originally they had done something similar.
Speaker 1:What is it? It's like a vessel.
Speaker 2:But yeah, so now they'll take like, let's say, like a huge. Oh, like you know, farms have milk, huge steel, like a gas station would have a huge milk, maybe like a huge gas steel thing barrel, I don't know Like, if you imagine, you've seen like LP gas, lp gas, you've seen LP gas steel kind of.
Speaker 1:It's just like a big steel barrel, big big steel kind of thing, and you get in there and you just toss yourself. Well, they put padding in it, I love how I feel like I am watching a cartoon in my head, trying to understand.
Speaker 2:OK, this is what you're going to love. This is what you're going to love, since you're so kind of trying to figure this out. So they take a steel barrel and they do some welding and they seal it, obviously, and then they create some padding on the inside and straps. Strap yourself in, because you're going to drop 170, I think three feet over the falls. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:This is giving me the Titanic summary vibe. No, it's so cool.
Speaker 2:I wanted to write a book especially about this dude that went over without a barrel and survived, but anyways, that's another story. But one guy went over with a kayak and died Jesse forget his name, and I called his mom. I called his mom.
Speaker 1:Wait, wait. I'm sorry you witnessed this?
Speaker 2:No, no, I was just. I was just researching.
Speaker 1:Oh, and that's degrading, ok.
Speaker 2:I called his mom and got permission to use the footage. Holy cow, that was a hard call, I bet it was. So I mean and this is journalism- I know.
Speaker 2:So it was journalism, so I'm like I got the mom's number. There's two of the toughest calls that I ever did Was this one in another player, NBA player, who what's his name? Anyways, I don't want to sidetrack, Let me stay focused on this, Jesse's mom. I called her up and you could just tell Like she was just broken by this. I mean, it had been like 10 years after the fact.
Speaker 2:And he went and he was so sure of his success he made dinner plans down the river. They never found his body and so I called her up and I was like you know, first I want to just my condolences. Yeah, you know this is probably tough and I don't mean to bring up that and this is who I am. I work with that geo and we're telling the story and we have the footage of your son and we're probably going to tell the story. But I want to be respectful to you and ask your permission. Can we tell the story? Because I go, I want to focus on what your son loved his passion.
Speaker 2:Like. I don't want to exploit your son, but your son clearly did this enough that he loved it and was willing to do this, and it was an unfortunate end. But I want to celebrate like who he was.
Speaker 1:So he had done it successfully before.
Speaker 2:No, he never did it successfully. No one's ever done it successfully on a kayak. I don't think anyone will. I wouldn't do it and I'm not encouraging that on that show. Do Niagara Falls on a kayak? Don't? Full disclosure.
Speaker 2:Not a good idea, don't do it, but anyway. So what I was telling you is they build these barrels, they make padding, and I started learning about all these guys in the different ways they did it and it was funny. I got ahold of this reporter for the Buffalo News and her name was Ann Neville and Ann Neville would say well, steve Trotter is not an authentic daredevil, dave Munday, he went over without padding, without oxygen, and just strapped himself into the barrel and I'm like it was funny because you know, in life you think about sports and how they move closer to authenticity. Oh, that's a really great player and that guy's not. Because he doesn't do I never would have thought in barrel riding over Niagara Falls, we would get into authenticity.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's almost like. It sounds like who can be stupider? Yeah?
Speaker 2:And Dave Munday was all about the boys. For him it was a bonding experience. Steve was all about the promo and Steve was the guy who went off of the Golden Gate Bridge on a swing and halfway through the rope broke Him and another girl went, or three people swung off the Golden Gate and they didn't plan it right. The rope wasn't strong enough and it broke and the girl broke her back. It was a famous story in like, anyways he was crazy.
Speaker 1:He's a Floridian. He's a Floridian. Where does he live now?
Speaker 2:I think he's passed. I think he passed away. He was in rough shape when I got a hold of him and when I got a hold of him I was worried because he was going. I'm going to go over again and I think it was because we were talking to him. And he wanted to use it as a spin and I'm like I'll do it, he wanted more time yeah.
Speaker 2:He'd gone over twice, he was like I'm going to do it again. I'm like no. And when I talked to him and got to know him I was like he seemed a little raw. He was like closer to 50, and he lived a hard life. I'm like not a good idea.
Speaker 1:Don't do it, dave, I'm not.
Speaker 2:Dave, Steve don't do it. Don't do it, don't go.
Speaker 1:That's funny. Oh my god, we've talked about so much. I've been wearing all these cue cards, but we didn't use them.
Speaker 2:That's all right. I do want to play. We did have fun, though, didn't we?
Speaker 1:Well, I want to play a little game before we go and also make sure you talk about like plug your book a little bit more. I have a game for you. It's called Very Good or Very Bad.
Speaker 2:Oh, you did that. Oh, I remember you doing that with Sharra, with Sharra, yeah, I haven't brought the paddle out in a bit, but here's your paddle. Oh, I get to hold it, I get to hold it.
Speaker 1:We want to get to know you a little bit more.
Speaker 2:This is awesome.
Speaker 1:All right, you're upbringing in Michigan. You touched on it. Was it very good or was it very bad?
Speaker 2:Oh, it was very good, very good. I grew up in the country. I was a country boy and my parents wouldn't. There was no video games or anything. They'd just say go out and play, and I would just go in the woods.
Speaker 2:And the reason I've done so many adventures and stuff is my mom would literally be like go out and play and my dad was a Vietnam vet and he had all this old military clothing, so I'd throw on the old camo and his old boots and I would just go out in the woods for hours.
Speaker 1:And it was one of those like don't come back till it's dark, don't?
Speaker 2:come back till dinner. My mom literally had a dinner bell.
Speaker 1:I have one, I have like three of them.
Speaker 2:It was a big triangle and we'd be out in the woods.
Speaker 1:You'd hear it, that's so cool.
Speaker 2:I was a country boy.
Speaker 1:Very good. What do you have to say about Hollywood Hollyweird?
Speaker 2:Hollywood.
Speaker 1:Very good, very bad, oh, that's tough.
Speaker 2:I know that's a.
Speaker 1:I don't I. Tell us a very bad and tell us a very good about Hollywood.
Speaker 2:Well, maybe I'll start with the bad and then end with the good, but the bad side of Hollywood was what I had gosh. I don't know if I want to talk about that story.
Speaker 1:It's in my book.
Speaker 2:And it's such an intense story but I had. So I worked on, I got my start. I was really lucky. I got my start working on films with Brooke Shields, jennifer Lopez, will Smith and I did all these things. I have this great story about Jennifer Lopez.
Speaker 2:Literally, we were doing a L'Oreal commercial and I was a PA. I was a favorite PA on set and she came out. Well, they said, barry, why don't you hold this heater? I had this big heater for her. She was literally going to get in the water naked, with just bottoms, no top. They built this huge pool, infinity pool. She was going to kind of push up into the camera, like you know, those commercials and the limited crew, just the DP and the director and I don't know why they picked me, this young PA at 25, to hold this heater. But, dude, when she came out, she came out in a robe and it was just us and my eyes must have been like this big and she looked over and she's like him out. Literally, I got kicked out, I got kicked out. So maybe that's the best Barry bad story that I should tell. It gets darker, it gets darker. There's a dark side of Hollywood that I experienced Really dark.
Speaker 1:Did you see the darkness?
Speaker 2:I mean, I was on an all gay crew and I was the hot chick in a law firm, basically and look, this isn't me making a statement but I'm not gay and I was just there to work and the sexual harassment that I experienced was beyond inappropriate and it ultimately ended in me leaving Hollywood for a while because I had a real.
Speaker 2:I had a really. I was in Tennessee. I was in Nashville, Tennessee, and I had a producer. I never exposed his name or anything, but I had a producer kind of put me in a compromising situation. He invited me to go to a party. The director's going to be here the night before.
Speaker 2:I had gone out with Wanona, Judd and you know the Judd sisters, Wanona, Naomi, and we were hanging out. I got this great photo. We were hanging out in a bar and they had us up there and I remember I sat next to Wanona. They moved the manager and they put me right next to her and Wanona goes. I didn't know you were going to be here, honey, and this is another one of my favorite stories and I go, she goes. If I were only 23 again, and I said why you got to be 23? And she goes. Well, I did just get divorced and I am feeling a little loosey-goosey. And at the same time she reached over and touched me on the knee and I was I want to say this appropriately, but maybe she wasn't the most attractive woman for me.
Speaker 2:OK, ok, let's just say this and I kind of froze up and I loved her as a person but I wasn't really into that situation and she was so cool, she leaned into me and she goes. Don't worry, honey, mama would kill me in the morning.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh.
Speaker 2:Dude, I love her, I love her, anyways. But then the night before, the night after, I got invited to a party and just wasn't a party. I got in a hotel room with someone I didn't want to be in a hotel room with, and it just these are so many stories. You hear that women tell yeah, well, that's the thing, and that's why it's in my book, because what's the Me Too movement?
Speaker 1:Yeah, the Me Too.
Speaker 2:The Me Too movement isn't only one-sided, Because, like I literally, you know, he served me a drink. I just remember like falling asleep, not being able to stay awake. I remember him leaving the room and coming back and trying to give me a back rub. And I'm a big man and I'm a very big man and I wasn't completely asleep, but I remember just trying to push him away, but to this day I don't know why I couldn't come out of it. And then I just I woke up. I was fully clothed, on the side of my bed, on the side of the bed the next morning, but I just remember falling asleep and never, and I just like it was just so horrible, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:I'm not saying anything happened, but it was a really odd, weird night and that. I never wanted to experience again, and at that point I was a PA, I was vulnerable and I was just like this isn't, and so for a while I left the industry altogether. I got out and I went into education and left the industry. And then I came back Like PTSD. Oh no, that was completely demoralizing. I was like, on this trajectory I was meeting Jennifer Love-Hewitt you remember Love-Hewitt.
Speaker 2:You know, I had all. I was on this trajectory and I was just like growing in the industry and I had this experience and I'm like this is too dark.
Speaker 1:Have you seen the Morning Show? I think it's on.
Speaker 2:Yes, I have with Jen Anderson there's so much to that, yeah, no there's the dark side, like when people all these conspiracies about the industry dude. I just had a buddy call me last night who's living out there. There is a dark side of the industry. That cannot be denied.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, in any industry, I guess.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I guess so.
Speaker 1:Speaking Italian.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're very good. You're very good. Parli bene italiano. I would say, I'm conversational.
Speaker 1:Good, what about Spanish?
Speaker 2:I'm gonna speak Spanish.
Speaker 1:That's probably about it A little bit.
Speaker 2:I can have a conversation in Italian. Like I can, we could open up, that's good. I can't, but I can order food in Spanish.
Speaker 1:Good, okay, got it. What about Melbourne Florida? Is it very good or very good?
Speaker 2:Very good, I love it here. I love it.
Speaker 1:What about it's like laid back lifestyle? Can I just plug?
Speaker 2:O'Galley, which I love.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you get it.
Speaker 2:Even more than Melbourne. I love O'Galley. Yeah, you get it. That's from my offices, really.
Speaker 1:I just want to prop those. Where are you at?
Speaker 2:I am on Highland. Yeah, I'm on Highland. Yeah, Cool, I'm just in the Ginter building. Ginter building, the old building that has the back half cut off because the old train tracks used to run there. Get out of town. Yeah, and there's a hole in the ground that the guy who owns it now is filling in, but that's the last of the trench where the train tracks used to run.
Speaker 1:Cool and I think I've ever. Do you have a sign up?
Speaker 2:I do, it's a little one.
Speaker 1:I'm always at Derek Gore's gallery.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, I know Gore how far is that. He's just a little bit further down the street, away from the center of town north, it's off. Grumpies, yeah yeah, Grumpies, Grumpies, biscuits. Give those guys a prop. Well, listen, if you're listening in the local area, give a prop to Grumpies. And then also they have Cuban barbecue back there.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 2:So Frank is the owner of the building in real estate direct and so he's bringing in and trying to create a little food corner over there. So come, get some food and say hi. I like that. Should I say say hi? I don't know, I could have random people. Like, oh, I just have a small office with a desk. That's it, folks.
Speaker 1:It's not that exciting Welcome to say hi, I want to see it, you can, Anyone else? It's by appointment only. By appointment only people. Michael Moore.
Speaker 2:Very good, very good. Yeah, it's funny you mentioned him.
Speaker 1:I worked on two of his films. Oh which ones Sikko and Capitalism.
Speaker 2:Okay, so here's my thing with Michael Moore. I have a little bone to pick. Can I pick it?
Speaker 1:up yeah, pick it.
Speaker 2:I was a huge fan of Michael Moore Fahrenheit 9-11, Roger and me and I watched his story and how he made it in the industry and I've learned a lot of tips from him. My only thing with Michael Moore, as I've gotten older and more aware, is he was a bit of a propagandist, yeah, and so and that's, but in a I don't know, I liked it. Yeah, entertaining.
Speaker 1:Yeah, entertaining exactly.
Speaker 2:But for the uneducated audience, like I look at it, like I had some naivete so I'm like, oh, that's all true.
Speaker 1:Uh-huh yeah.
Speaker 2:And for the, my criticism is that is probably more that the audience should be aware of that, that it's one-sided, yeah, but audiences aren't very it's hard to you know.
Speaker 1:I guess you're right. They should be more aware of that.
Speaker 2:I mean, roger, I like to kind of, you know, rip on the man. Yeah, and so Roger and me. I was all about that. Fahrenheit 9-11 made sense because I saw that whole the Bush era. That was just such a crock. But I look back on that and I go well, there were two sides of the story and probably I didn't really fully understand the whole picture.
Speaker 1:There's always two sides, but I do like the way he tells his stories. They're fun.
Speaker 2:I'm with you. I wish I could do more, a little bit better like that, I know right he makes it.
Speaker 1:I don't know something to aspire to.
Speaker 2:He was killing it for a while there and he started as a journalist in San Francisco. He's got an interesting story. I met one of his producers who lives in Rochester, michigan actually where I was living before and got to chat with him a little bit about Michael. He's just an interesting dude.
Speaker 1:He really is. I'll do one more. Barry Manilow oh, barry Manilow's very good. Since you share a name, I've done all. Barry good, yeah, good for you, Barry, doesn't he do?
Speaker 2:let's do a Manilow song. What's a song?
Speaker 1:Lugine. What's that one about his dog?
Speaker 2:I don't know the one about his dog. I like this. This is like a tough channel. I'm drawing a blank, but it's like what's this diamond, what's that? Oh, that's Neil Diamond Barry.
Speaker 1:Manilow, we're mixing. I don't know. I thought maybe you should, because people have the same name. You either hate them and you hate when people bring up Barry Manilow.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love it when people bring up. You know, what I love even more is when and I want to say this appropriately, but African American or black culture calls me Barry White.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2:And then we have something in common, yeah.
Speaker 1:I'm like yeah, baby, all right, barry, thank you for playing. Yeah, I'm gonna gift you. We got new T-shirts in Wait a minute.
Speaker 2:Wait a minute.
Speaker 1:Only local celebrities that come on our show get the pleasure. Oh my gosh, this is cool.
Speaker 2:You know, I love your show oh thank you so much by the way this place. I think you guys are onto something. This place is full of, like, hidden gems.
Speaker 1:I think so too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, if we could all this place is full of hidden gems you guys need. If you hidden gems out there, hit these guys out.
Speaker 1:I'm glad you hit us up because, yeah, I'll have to send you some of those names that I mentioned. Yeah, can you mention them on?
Speaker 2:Yeah so the hidden gems that I personally love.
Speaker 1:Yeah, please nominate some.
Speaker 2:Okay, well, I would start at. I should have written them down. I have them on my phone, but I would start with did you write them?
Speaker 1:down, I did, julia Pizic.
Speaker 2:Okay, julia is I connected with her. She's a fascinating person, new to the area, and she worked on the Barat series and did, in particular, work directly with the Rudy G remember the whole Rudy Giuliani scene, the Rudy Giuliani scene where he's dripping like his hair dye or whatever, and she was fascinating. She worked on that and she's kind of an interesting cat. I even asked her. I said, hey, do you mind if I tell these guys about you? I'll give her your name.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, tell her, cause that's a good.
Speaker 2:So she's cool. Who was the young girl that I wrote?
Speaker 1:down Ella Grace Hilton. She acted with Adam Sandler and I even saw her last week.
Speaker 2:She lives here, she lives here and she's she's a satellite talent. So this is we live in this age where you don't have to live in the major If you build the network, yeah, especially after the pandemic, yeah you have to go there and build the network and you have to show up yeah, and then you can. That can be hard, but you can live anywhere, and so she lives here and her mom lives here Her mom's super cool.
Speaker 1:Does she do any local theater or is she just doing big things?
Speaker 2:She, she did, she was in the, she was in the Melbourne Film Festival.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I wanted to talk a little bit about that.
Speaker 2:She had a little film, a student film or something?
Speaker 1:I saw you were there too. Did you do something for that?
Speaker 2:The Artemis piece.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay, I was there too. Like we must have crossed paths that night, yeah they just started doing documentaries and I love that.
Speaker 2:And they, so we. I was in the documentary block, which is cool.
Speaker 1:Yeah, really cool.
Speaker 2:But she's, yeah, she was with Adam Sandler and she's such a cute, awesome little girl.
Speaker 1:You gotta get her and her mom in here. I want a kid to come in here or have like a kid's tape, like I mean kids say that during the big break.
Speaker 2:She presents herself so well. She's so cool. You gotta get her An eloquent kid. Yeah, she's cool.
Speaker 1:Good, what about Jamie Engel he's a writer for film.
Speaker 2:Oh, I'm so sorry, Jamie.
Speaker 1:Missgendered Cancel me.
Speaker 2:I got to know her. She's with Brevard Film and Talent. So I think they changed their name because Brevard, the acronym for Brevard Film and Talent, is BFAT and everyone's like why don't we not call ourselves BFAT anymore? So they changed. But there's they comboed up with I think it's women in women in film and women in film and something with with.
Speaker 1:It's a, it's a club here.
Speaker 2:Women of film and talent or something like that. Well, that club is a state. Bfat is a local club women in film and I'm getting the acronym wrong. Anyone hit them up on the chat and correct me. They're comm comboed up and they have a group here. So if you want to get involved locally, hit up BFAT and hit up the women in. I'm totally screwing this up. I should look it up.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Let me look this up, so so we don't screw this up, cause I want to give these guys props.
Speaker 1:It's a, I had no idea there was a community here. I mean, I guess we're all just well hidden.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, and that's why I'm saying I think you guys are onto something and it should be. It's called women in film and television.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:And they. They're a great network, they're film, they're with film Florida and they're all over. But they have a Melbourne group that's connected with BFAT, which they're going to kill me for calling at them.
Speaker 1:I think it's kind of funny. It's kind of funny, it's kind of funny. It fits perfectly. It's unforgettable, right, yeah, they should yeah. And then, last but not least, jim Lewis and Bill Williams, you mentioned.
Speaker 2:So these guys are respectfully quirky old dudes.
Speaker 1:I love quirky old dudes.
Speaker 2:That are old, classic ENG kind of shooters in the industry and they've been working with NASA since the shuttle era and they've been here for a long time. Bill has a studio, a studio up in Cape Canaveral CCI, and Bill I mean Bill Jim has a studio in Cape Canaveral called CCI and Bill Williams has a cut above. But I think those guys would be fun to just get on as a pair and get them jamming and because they get along with their competitors, but they're the good 80s style competitors.
Speaker 1:Like. They're not like when you could still be chummy yeah they're like it's all good. Yeah, it's all good.
Speaker 2:You know, I don't know. Healthy competition, healthy competition. We don't have to go deep on every topic.
Speaker 1:I was thinking about my brand.
Speaker 2:I'm like my brand is deep. I was like Sharke. It's brand is all good and up and up and I was like mine's kind of deep.
Speaker 1:Well, I mean, I know we've run out of time, but I'd love to have you back on Never enough time, never enough time. I gotta map out like two hours for you. Come back and tell us about your current doc that you're working on and when your book comes out.
Speaker 2:That's good, because we can hold up for all that, because that's coming out next year really.
Speaker 1:What time?
Speaker 2:Well, the doc were still working progress, but I have a writer working on the final. He had to do a little bit of rerouting graphics guy and we're getting into festivals next year.
Speaker 1:Cool.
Speaker 2:And then I just jumped on with a publisher and we're starting to work on getting an editor on my book and getting that out either by the end of 24 or early 25.
Speaker 1:Fun. Well, we'll have to have you on before then. Yeah, I'll hit you up. So I'll hit you up next year. It was such a pleasure meeting you.
Speaker 2:I wish you had more time. This was awesome. You guys are awesome.
Speaker 1:Thank you To be a sponsor or nominated guest. Hit us up on the socials Until next time. Bye.